Party Corgi Podcast

MDXConf Speaker: Prince Wilson

Episode Summary

MDX Conference speaker interview with Prince Wilson.

Episode Notes

Episode Transcription

Prince Wilson: [00:00:00] Hey friends. Hi, Chris, how are you doing? Doing great. It is a lovely day.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:00:10] Um, I'm really happy to hear that. Um, I have not looked outside yet today. I should do that.  

Prince Wilson: [00:00:18] Fortunately, he's like a window right in front of my computer. So I just have a beautiful view of the city. That sounds  

Chris Biscardi: [00:00:27] wonderful, actually. I used to live in like, uh, on the, like the 12th or 13th, or like before people buildings don't have 13th floors, 14 floors, something like that.

It was wonderful. I could see the entire city and San Francisco is like this whirling city, which was really nice. So let's get started. And, uh, you mentioned to me that video games have impacted your thinking about software development. I'm very curious as to, uh, what that means for you.  

Prince Wilson: [00:00:58] Yeah. Uh, I think like for the.

Biggest ways that it's like really helped me, at least with regards to things, you got software development. It's like, there's like a common example around like tutorials and like how, the way that you ease into like a video game is like how they showcase you, how to do everything. And typically you don't want to like, stop the experience you want to keep going through while you're in the app.

And I think that I say app, but I mean more like video games, um, but like in an apps as well as, so you want to just experience what you could have in the app. And be able to do those things right then and there, I think a lot of the rules around video games is like to not break the user's experience in terms of like, Oh, like you're going through this story in the same way.

And using an app is the same way as you just have to ease into it, as opposed to here, let me throw all the ads at you.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:01:51] Yeah, I think that, um, you're absolutely right. I think that the way that. Game designers, think about how things are supposed to work out. And like, I know you know this, but where I'm going through the understanding by design stuff.

And I know that you have a long history in that field and thinking about it. Um, and it seems to connect here, uh, very well. Can you talk a little bit about maybe how like, The level design that you were just talking about, uh, correlates to like an instructional design kind of way of thinking about things.

Prince Wilson: [00:02:24] Yeah. I think a lot about, um, there's ways, especially with like instructional design. I really think about like, All that kind of stick together. It's like, there's see seamless interactions that happen as you're going through, you know, of course, video game. There's just these words, noting to you as you're going through these experiences without you explicitly receiving that information.

And I think that shows like a good development is good thought process around, like, how do you want to organize thoughts, uh, at work at news ELA, we think about this all the time as terms of like, we want give users the ability to interact with. Their applications in ways that they need, as opposed to the ways that we think they need it.

And I think that really goes and speaks true to like how we have to think about how do they solve their own needs, as opposed to how we think they should be solving any needs. Because if you cause that friction thinking for how they're supposed to do it, as opposed to just enabling them to do what they need to be doing, um, it ends up actually causing more friction than it removes.

Chris Biscardi: [00:03:23] That's really interesting because it sort of implies that there isn't supposed to be like a linear start here and there to curriculum. Right. So if there's no start here and there, which, I mean, I think what we're all familiar with, uh, places that do that kind of thing, what do we do? How does it work?

Prince Wilson: [00:03:44] Honestly that it's, it's a challenge. I think that really it's about figuring out, like, how do you reassess, like the knowledge. It it's, it's not always clear that like, Oh, I, they need to show, you know, this, then this, then that, then this, as opposed to you kind of, kind of give them exposure to all the things as you need to, you give them some sort of pathways.

So that way they at least understand like the end goal, but then go get, and kind of in the reverse, you have to think about like, what are the ways that we build up to that? What are the ways that we kind of check off all the things that we need to along the way as opposed to like, they must go in this order, in this way, every single time, because some people learn things quicker, some things click in different ways for people.

Um, it's just very, it's not a one right solution even like for people who are masters of everything, they won't show one singular way of learning everything.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:04:37] That reminds me of something that Joel says about, uh, like learning, being  

Prince Wilson: [00:04:41] a graph. Yeah.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:04:43] And, uh, he always gets very excited when that topic comes up.

Prince Wilson: [00:04:47] I think it's, I think it's accurate though. Um, I like this concept in learning theory, it's called constructivism. Um, the general idea is that like people's knowledge is kind of constructed literally through like the things that they experienced and then reflecting on those experiences. Um, and like, there's not just like, Oh, I read this thing, but rather like, Going through and doing like an exercise or going and thinking about how everything else connects to the things that I know shows a deeper connections into the things that you're learning here and there.

Um, and that's kind of the, probably the more talked about learning theory concept that's out there. That's shown real promise. Hmm.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:05:26] Yeah. Like, I'm just getting into this to like, when you say shows real promise, what are the other options look? But like what you just said sounds makes sense to me, but like  

Prince Wilson: [00:05:35] what else is there?

That's an excellent point. I think a lot of people are kind of know they have experienced what is known as like rope memorization, uh, where you you're given information and your job is seen, retain that information by rereading that or digesting it in some way. Um, and in some. In some ways that is really easy to do, uh, but retention and that information isn't, you know, for a long period of time.

And I think that's really what we're thinking about is not just like how easy is it to get that information? How, how easy is it to have that information for you, but really to have deeper connections with it, to keep it in your longterm memory? Cause that's ultimately the whole process of educators is taking things that are in your short term memory and converting that into longterm memory.

Chris Biscardi: [00:06:22] I like that. I mean, that makes sense. But like, how do you take something? Like, okay, so I've crammed for tests, right? Yes. And then I forget it almost immediately, but like, I keep it in my memory, like short term memory, I assume this is what this is. It's like, I keep it as long enough to take the test and then I'm like, I don't need it.

Um, so like what, what does it take to like move something from that short term? Or like, not necessarily cramming, but like short term into that longterm memory.  

Prince Wilson: [00:06:46] I think there's a few solutions that have really come. Up a one common theme that people have been doing recently is this concept of space repetition, where you're trying to take in information over periods of time consistently in a way that allows you to keep bringing it back in term in your, the front of your mind.

So that way you're having more neural pathways being fired off as you're learning something. Um, and that works like in. In comparison to just like try to study as much as possible at one period of time, the concept of for space repetition is like, I can learn a thing, come back to it seven days later, make sure to learn that thing and kind of keep doing that and figuring out also what are the things that I'm not understanding and reflecting and putting more time to getting those neuropathways fired off.

Um, there's not a. There's not a one size fits all. Unfortunately, with learning theory, there's now like, Oh, here's the solve problem for how to learn everything the best, uh, even, uh, Learning theories, the concept around like you might've heard like, yeah. An auditory learner, a visual learner, and those are things that we've learned.

Aren't actually true. Then you aren't just one type of learner. You actually learn in all these different modalities. Um, and. The each one of them helps you learn something deeper just in different ways. And a lot of people will be like, Oh, well, I don't really like curing things. I'd rather see it. Um, and that's just because you don't exercise that skill as often.

And so it's harder to do so you don't get as much information from it. And that's kind of why people kind of draw this connection between like, Oh, like I don't want to, you know, watch a 13 minute video, but rather it's spend like 13 minutes reading an article.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:08:28] Yeah, that the, that makes sense to me, but mostly because it affirms my worldview and I never felt like I fit into any of those categories.

So really easy to agree with stuff that you already agree with.  

Prince Wilson: [00:08:42] It's the same way for me is like, I, I have never felt like I was just one type of way, I think for different topics. I learned differently the best. Uh, like sometimes I like hearing people talk about things, but in other cases, like I hate hearing things like conference talks.

I probably won't remember after the conference talk, but give me an article. I'll read that and I'll be like taking notes on it. And that just works for me. I don't know why I just don't do the same things in those same experiences.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:09:11] Yeah. Um, so you're, you're a person that writes blog posts and you work at an ed tech company and, uh, you're a part of like head and things like that.

And like, but how does this impact, like the stuff you produce, like the, the blog posts, et cetera, uh, that you create the teach people.  

Prince Wilson: [00:09:29] I think a lot about like, what are the mechanisms that I can teach people with? Um, yeah. You know, working with MDX, it really lets me kind of play with his creativity.

Whereas like I have a vision for like building an article or building a blog posts and I can truly put more interactive things into it. There's this great article that was produced called quantum country. Um, and it's basically this very long form article about quantum mechanics. Uh, it was intended specifically to be used for people.

So. To convert things into their longterm memory. And I think about this article all the time, because it just does a great job of highlighting how you can embed exercises along the way as you're reading this article that allows you to like, do that actual work of current ratings. Me from short term memory to long term memory, because the goal of the article is to actually.

Nudge you again, and then make you go through questions that you answered before to try to engage there. And I think about how do I incorporate that into my own content? Like, how do I make content that you want to actually interact with and like quiz yourself with, because even though it seems like quizzes or like, Oh, I don't want to do those things.

They're important because they actually, they convert from being a passive engager to an active engager and that active mode of engaging with content. Is it is where every content creator is trying to get people to go to, even if they don't intentionally know that that's like, that's like, what they're trying for is to try to give you information in a way that lets you you to be activated with it.

Chris Biscardi: [00:11:04] I just checked out this quantum country, uh, site and it looks extremely interesting and extremely on topic for what you're talking about. And um, like you've talked about. Producing content that engages people and things like that. Um, how does this affect, like, how does the creation of this content and the way that you've been thinking about it and learning about how to like, create that content inspire, like the learning that you take on to, uh, I guess cycle back and eventually create content about the stuff that you've now learned  

Prince Wilson: [00:11:37] and.

I think for me, like when I'm learning something new, I have to make it fun. Um, I have to make it silly cause otherwise it won't stick with me. I, I feel like, uh, going through right now, I'm going through a lot of the rust book and I take exercises and just make them very silly just to see like where things break and whatnot.

And I think the same is true in the way that I want to create my content is I want it to feel playful. And it's something that you can kind of. Toy around with an break. Cause I think that's also part of the experience is you can't know all of the perfect steps because you won't ultimately, you won't know what to do when it goes wrong.

I think it was back in college. My, my. My first year, professor really encouraged that part for us is really told us like, Hey, just break things. It's totally okay to break things. Cause that's like, that'd be your job for the rest of your life now. Um, um, like everyone jokes about it, you know, you're gonna write bugs and whatnot.

And I think that is still true to this day. I still write bugs. I'm not intentionally, I'm not going to go out of my way. Right. But I think it's also good to know that like I will. I will have things that break and it's, it's more of an opportunity for me to engage and be like, how do I, how do I make it not break?

So we don't do that again.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:12:55] Yeah. That's awesome. And, uh, I've seen your streams and you do a very, very good job of like, Taking this very, I don't know. I think people think of rust as like hard tech, right? It's statically typed. It's got a compiler that yells at you all the time. It's low level, but you make a really good job of, uh, on your live streams, just making it a little filly and like engaging people and like, uh, taking that sort of like thing that people think of as kind of hard and tech or whatnot and making it, uh, exactly what you were just talking  

Prince Wilson: [00:13:26] about.

I appreciate that. Thank you.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:13:30] So you do have one more thing that you wanted to talk about, um, participating in party corgi and being surrounded by a community of practitioners. What does a community of practitioners mean?  

Prince Wilson: [00:13:42] I think, um, for me, uh, I, I thrive by being around people who are constantly doing the things that they want to be doing.

I think for me, like a community of practitioners are really people who. Are interested in a topic or interest of doing things. And they put that work and surround themselves to keep themselves accountable for doing that work. And the party Carnegie community truly has done a lot of that. They are exactly the types of people where, I mean, originally when I wanted to.

Do blog posts. I would say, you know, I'm going to do this blog post I go and redesign my website and I'll be like, all right, cool. So I redesigned my website, uh, but then I didn't put any content on that blog. Uh, and I feel like that is a very big trap that people can fall into, but the party Korean community really kind of like reminds each other that it's okay to produce content.

It's also okay to not produce content, uh, but like to constantly be learning. And I, I feel that energy that surrounds me constantly is what energizes me to. Be able to do the things that I want to be doing in the ways that I want to be doing it is not like, Oh, you must be producing blog posts every single day.

And content doesn't look the same between each person. Like it can look different ways for different people. And I think that that's so important to recognize because it eases this tension of, Oh, well, I need to do it this way. Otherwise people won't read my things or it's not as engaging, but it's like, no, everyone has their own way of doing it.

And I think that's what I've. I love about it.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:15:14] Yeah, that man, I really liked that description. Um, we are at time, these are meant to be pretty short. So where can people find you on the internet?  

Prince Wilson: [00:15:25] You can find me anywhere on the internet, basically under the handle. Maxell max C E L L.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:15:34] And do you have a Twitch three main schedule or anything like that?

Prince Wilson: [00:15:39] I do my live streams at six 30 Eastern standard at 6:30 PM. Eastern standard on Tuesdays  

Chris Biscardi: [00:15:48] and 6:30 AM would be rough. I can do it,  

Prince Wilson: [00:15:51] but no one would show up.  

Chris Biscardi: [00:15:55] Thank you so much for doing this and I'm looking forward to your talk.  

Thank you.